Author Topic: hotwire lamps spreadsheet  (Read 10440 times)

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Offline wquiles

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Re: hotwire lamps spreadsheet
« Reply #15 on: November 04, 2005, 10:37:49 PM »
Thank you Andrew for all of your hard work on these hotwire mods and the data compilation in the spreadsheet!!!

Will

Offline LuxLuthor

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Re: hotwire lamps spreadsheet
« Reply #16 on: April 27, 2007, 03:50:58 AM »
This is an old topic that is still a great resource.

Offline andrewwynn

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Re: hotwire lamps spreadsheet
« Reply #17 on: May 01, 2007, 03:48:57 PM »
that's got to be just about the longest gap between posts of all times. About 3-4x/year i get an email from somebody saying they found the hotrater and are using it or just use it 'in context'.. i.e. 'according to hotrater'. it works exceptionally well.. the thing that is key to it working so well is the circular references... as far as i'm aware it's the first and only device that takes the resistance of the light into account and re-calculates the new lamp voltage, which will be lower, dropping the current which decreases the voltage drop on the lamp circuit, raising the lamp voltage, which increases the current.. as you can see.. it 'bounces up n down'.. thankfully excel will do 'iterations' and keep making small changes 'til it 'settles in'.. I have evolved the hotrater over the past 2 years and plan to eventually get a more modern model posted.

-awr
Regulated hotwire driver. click here now for the Surefire M6
3-level high-power LED drop-in for mag. click here (coming soon)

Offline Geologist

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Re: hotwire lamps spreadsheet
« Reply #18 on: May 01, 2007, 03:53:53 PM »
:popcorn:
Dragon, Ti, and Classic Chammies, Blk, Bare, & Brass LCs, Blk & Bare LHs, X990, Rayzorlite, The Torch, Mag85, MagGH24, SF C3, C2, 6P, G2, & Winelights, Peak Caribbean, Pacific, McKinnleys, + more , Exolion Ti, Orb Raw NS, SS Gatlight, Eternalights, Nuwai QIII, Inova X5THAs, X1, ARCs, + more?

Offline LuxLuthor

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Re: hotwire lamps spreadsheet
« Reply #19 on: May 02, 2007, 03:31:37 AM »
Andrew, in the version of the hotrater chart I got from Jimmy it does not have the 1166 bulb in it.  Just wondering how you got the values to add a new bulb type.  It is very handy.  BTW, I bumped up that 1166 1D and a longer one to 12.7V instead of your 12.55 and it is much brighter...almost 1,000 lumens for about a lost hour of bulb life which is a worthwhile tradeoff.

Is there any reason NOT to always use the high power version of the Hot Driver (vs. basic one)...I mean do both have the same voltage adjusting ranges you can set?   Thanks

Offline andrewwynn

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Re: hotwire lamps spreadsheet
« Reply #20 on: May 04, 2007, 12:34:39 AM »
i get the base values from the WA page.. a shortcut to their re-rater is http://bulbrater.rouse.com change the URL to include the lamp you want, and you'll get a re-rate page from them.. it does not change the current though.

we blew plenty of 1166s at >12.6V through trial and error determined that a 'lamp life' <8 hrs is not really worth the risk even with regulation.

at 12.7V the output of 1166 is 627L.. at 12.55 it is 601L.. the 12.55 is not 'arbitrary' it was designed to get 600L. (torch lumen is 65% of bulb lumen).

that is a 4% increase in brightness for a 1.1 hr drop in lamp life.. 15% drop in lamp life.. but the problem is.. the reality is the loss of lamp life will be more like 25-33% in reality. There is a sharp transition point between 6 hr and 8hr 're-rated' lamp life where the lamp is greatly reduced in reality of surviving startup once the filament is worn in.

That said, the neat thing about

the only diff between the 'high temp' (sometimes called high-power).. hotdriver is temperature monitoring.. it will shut off if the pcb temperature reaches 185F (85C).. the max temperature rated for the components.. it's a 'moot point' for lights where vLamp=vBat (nominal) like 9xNIMH and 1185 lamp.. in those cases there is virtually zero voltage dropped on the driver. I only use the high-temp models, of course i get them at a discount ;) but when building a light that ends up being $200 it's kinda short-sighted to cheap out on the $10 difference, but for a DIY situation i offer the basic model because people can really make a good deal saving about $30-35 from getting a complete KIU hotdriver high-temp.

i don't recommend basic models for any time the Pfet (power on the FET) is >4W or if the battery pack is >15 WH.. either can get enough heat into the driver to cause damage.

-awr
Regulated hotwire driver. click here now for the Surefire M6
3-level high-power LED drop-in for mag. click here (coming soon)

Offline LuxLuthor

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Re: hotwire lamps spreadsheet
« Reply #21 on: May 04, 2007, 04:41:34 AM »
Good information.  I swear the 6.7 hrs that 12.7V rerates the 1166 is not accurate.  I have at least 10 hours on it, and I was very careful once I finally figured out how to check/adjust the voltage of the hotdriver to make sure it was 12.69-12.70V.  I am using it in this Litho GB after tweaking the HD up to that voltage.  I usually use the light for 20-30 sec at a time, then off for 20-30sec.

I have about 6.5 hours on this 1.5D using another HD also set at 12.70 so I am thinking WA's rerating estimates are a little off.

Offline andrewwynn

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Re: hotwire lamps spreadsheet
« Reply #22 on: May 18, 2007, 06:59:05 PM »
the re-rating system is quite established.. i'm wondering if the short spurts with the low-impact start from the hotdriver is managing to add hours to the lamp.. that said.. more likely your estimates are off on total hours... with 1A (14650) cells you should be getting about 25 minutes per charge.. meaning 24 charge cycles per 10 hours... with 'stone cold' discharge..  6.7 hrs would be 16 charge cycles, also quite a lot.. do you really use the light enough to have gone through 20+ charge cycles on a single lamp ?
Regulated hotwire driver. click here now for the Surefire M6
3-level high-power LED drop-in for mag. click here (coming soon)

Offline LuxLuthor

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Re: hotwire lamps spreadsheet
« Reply #23 on: May 19, 2007, 07:51:10 AM »
the re-rating system is quite established.. i'm wondering if the short spurts with the low-impact start from the hotdriver is managing to add hours to the lamp.. that said.. more likely your estimates are off on total hours... with 1A (14650) cells you should be getting about 25 minutes per charge.. meaning 24 charge cycles per 10 hours... with 'stone cold' discharge..  6.7 hrs would be 16 charge cycles, also quite a lot.. do you really use the light enough to have gone through 20+ charge cycles on a single lamp ?

Hello!

Yes, I use it about 3-4 times a week, mostly use up the charge....and I'm only on the 2nd bulb since you sent it to me last Oct/Nov.  I think I replaced the bulb in Feb.  I do use it for shorter bursts...maybe average of 5-15 seconds.

Now I just got two more 1D's from FM that were tribored to accept 3 li-ion 123 accross. 3 parallel/2 series (7.4 volt, 2250 mAh)...but I just finished converting it to 3S, and AW just released new versions of his Protected 17670 ( 1600mAH ) that have the PCB allow 5A...so I'm putting those three and gonna try an 1185.  It's all stock now, and I'm not quite sure how the resistance will work, but I figure I can do the tailspring (wire) mod, and use one of the HotDrivers.

What did you say the stock Mag switch has for resistance?  I see your figures for the Hotrater XLS, but not sure what your HD ends up with again.  Also, if I wanted to measure the resistance of the HD outside of the light....is it valid to turn on switch and measure with probes in bipin holes?

Thanks for your help!

Offline andrewwynn

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Re: hotwire lamps spreadsheet
« Reply #24 on: May 24, 2007, 04:14:18 PM »
17670s don't have the chutzpah to push the 1185, so they won't hold voltage.. that said.. the combo will output more light than the optimized setup which is the 1331 lamp.

180 to 200 m? resistance (miliohm) for a stock switch, and 35mohm for stock tail spring. the resistance of a hotdriver in 'direct drive' mode is aproximately 15 miliohm.. 1/2 of that resistance is the lamp socket at 3.5 miliohm per pin. No you can't measure when off... to measure live resistance of a hotdriver you need to measure the mV drop across it while it's on..(measure from bat+ on the bottom to bat- on the side). it's not difficult to do with a bat. pack and wire jumpers.

You will only get an accurate reading when it's in 'direct drive' mode since of course if vBat is over vLamp you'll get the active variable resistance reading... so an 1185 solution with 1/2 or 3/4 depleted batteries (or 3x17670 almost immediately) will provide the set up for measuring voltage drop.. than you have to use the current either from hotdriver or measured directly (but that's very tricky).. resistance of the hotdriver will be mV reading divided by current or  typically for an 1185 you should see about 50mV drop at 3.35A.. (50mV/3.35A = 15mV).

-awr
Regulated hotwire driver. click here now for the Surefire M6
3-level high-power LED drop-in for mag. click here (coming soon)

Offline LuxLuthor

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Re: hotwire lamps spreadsheet
« Reply #25 on: May 24, 2007, 09:06:01 PM »
Yes, I actually started reading some beginning electronics books and now am undertanding how to use Ohms and other formulas to understand what you are saying.

I just finished using those new AW 17670 cells in the 3s 1D holder with stock spring, switch, and FM gold bi-pin holder and it works very well.  Next step is to put in one of your famous HD's, shorten & resistance-mod the tailcap spring to optimize performance with the 1185.  If I'm not happy with the output and duration, there are other alternatives too.

Thanks again for input.  Great thread to read again today.  So much to catch up to that you posted so long ago.